Subject: My Thoughts About Underage Sex
Story Codes: Mf Fm mf Mg Fb bg inc oral
Updated: August 27, 2012
Author: Kelly <pghpa_girl@yahoo.com>
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!!!WARNING!!!!
This file contains sexually explicit material which may include graphic
depictions of underage, nonconsensual and unprotected sex as well as incest,
adultery, sodomy and bestiality. It is distributed on a website clearly
identified as "For Adults Only". Possession by a minor is strictly
forbidden. If you are not legally empowered to be in possession of such
material, do not read it and delete it immediately.
This work is copyrighted 2012 to the author. It may be posted to non-
commercial "free" sites, or in the "free" area of commercial sites so long as
no changes are made to the content and the Author information is retained.
Any other use of this work is by written permission of the Author only.
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Summary:
I’ve posted a number of fantasies and stories that include references to sex
with underage children. In some cases these have been quite graphic and may
even be disturbing to some people. As a result I’ve received get a lot of
mail about it - most supportive but some not (to put it mildly). In almost
every case, positive or negative, I find that most people really don't
understand my true position on the subject so I wrote this article to try and
clear things up a bit.
Note:
Chapters 1-12 were originally written long before I was married. Because
these principle drove my behaviors for most of my life, I felt it important
to keep them in this article so that people can understand why I did some of
the things I did back then. Marriage has brought about a lot of changes in
my life which have affected my views on a number of issues, including
underage sex. Thus I provided an update in Chapter 12 to explain my current
“Thoughts About Underage Sex”.
Table of Contents:
Chapter 1 - Disclaimers
Chapter 2 - Definitions
Chapter 3 - My Core Principles
Chapter 4 - Summary
Chapter 5 - Some General Thoughts About Underage Sex
Chapter 6 - A Typical Girl's Sexual Timeline
Chapter 7 - Child Sex (under 8)
Chapter 8 - Child Sex (ages 8, 9)
Chapter 9 - Preteen Sex (ages 10-12)
Chapter 10 - Underage Teenage Sex (ages 13-17)
Chapter 11 - Incestual Sex
Chapter 12 - Changes in My Views
Chapter 1 - Disclaimers
=======================
Let me make this perfectly clear from the start....
This is not an article promoting child pornography or abuse. I do not trade
or even want photos of anyone under eighteen - clothed or otherwise. I do
NOT wish to promote or otherwise encourage or enable anyone to actually DO
anything illegal.
That said, I’ll readily admit that I encourage people to express their most
intimate and personal fantasies and desires, regardless of what they are.
This is predicated on the premise that such discussions are limited to a
person's FANTASIES and not any real actions on their part. I firmly believe
that personal fantasies should be respected, no matter how perverse or
disgusting they may seem to others (including me). I may not agree with
someone else’s fantasize about but I strongly believe in their right to have
them.
Chapter 2 - Definitions
=======================
It’s difficult to discuss a topic as touchy as underage sex without agreement
on the basic definitions. Many terms such as “sex” and “underage” are tossed
about with widely varying meanings. While I’m sure others have their own
definitions for these, I’ll use the following for the purposes of this
article. Remember to keep in mind these definitions are based on discussing
topics regarding sexual activity, not for legal or other purposes.
Sex
===
The penetration, however slight, of a female vagina by a male penis. Even if
the hymen remains intact and/or not all of the penis gets inside the vagina,
it's still sex. Once ANY part of a penis is in, even if it's just the very
tip, it's as good as ALL in so far as the act is concerned.
Family
======
The members of your immediate family out to and including aunts, uncles and
first cousins, whether by blood OR marriage. If someone is adopted legally,
then they become part of the family. When two people marry, their families
are merged into one and all are treated as members of the same family.
Adultery
========
When a married person has sex with someone not in their family with the
intent of cheating on their spouse. It’s the INTENT that determines whether
sex becomes adultery. Also, you can't commit adultery unless you're married.
If you're single and have sex with a married person without the consent of
their partner, THEY are the ones committing adultery, not you.
Incest
======
The act of sex between members of the same family. Based on my definition of
family, sex between in-laws is considered incest. If two people marry, sex
between their children would now become incestual whereas it wasn't before
they got married. Incest is all about families, regardless of how they are
created.
Oral "Sex"
==========
At its core, sex is fundamentally a reproductive act, even though most of the
time that isn't the intended purpose. Thus by definition, “oral sex" is NOT
sex. Because it’s NOT sex, engaging in “oral sex" cannot be considered
adultery OR incest. Note that by using the same logic, “anal sex" is not
true sex either.
Virgin
======
Someone who has never engaged in sex - male or female. Note that this
definition has nothing to do with the status of a girl's hymen. Many girls
rupture their hymens through sports, masturbation or other activities but
they are still virgins if they haven't had sex. Also, just because a man
doesn't penetrate a girl enough to break her hymen doesn't mean it wasn't
sex. If even so much as the very tip of a penis penetrates, then virginity
is lost.
Underage
========
A general term for anyone under the age of eighteen. I realize that "age of
consent" varies between states and countries but for purposes of this
article, the following age ranges are used:
Infant Child Preteen Teen Adult
------------- ----- -------- -------------- -----
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18+
While ages 1-7 is certainly not a good overall definition for “infant”, it
works so far as this article as anyone in this age bracket is treated the
same so far as sexual activities are concerned.
Chapter 3 - My Core Principles
==============================
Three basic principles guide my thoughts regarding underage sex:
1. The needs of the child ALWAYS come first. When it comes to sex or
anything even remotely related to it, if there is ANY doubt then don't
do it. It is ALWAYS better to err on the side of caution. I abhor
child abuse, especially sexual molestation and exploitation. People
who abuse children deserve the maximum punishment allowable.
2. Sex between adults and underage kids is illegal in the USA and most
countries. Thus as a general rule I don’t condone sex between adults
and minors, even when it’s incestual, as it rarely can be kept a
secret. Even in those cases where the opportunity is there, careful
consideration is required beforehand as to the potential
psychological, physical, moral, ethical and legal ramifications.
3. Incestual sex, at least when practiced properly and NOT as a
rationalization for child abuse, is different from "regular" sex in
that family love and support mechanisms are present. As a result the
"rules" for underage sex in incestual situations can be less
restrictive.
Chapter 4 - Summary
===================
Here is a summary of my opinions regarding underage sex:
Infant (7 and under)
YES: familiarization with nudity with instruction regarding modesty
information limited to that needed for protection from predators
NO: ANY sexual activity including oral sex and fondling of sex organs
ANY involvement in sexual activities, e.g. watching sex by others
ANY detailed discussions about sex
Exposure to pornographic images
Child (8-9)
YES: hand stimulation - self and others
observation of masturbation
discussions about sex focusing on the mechanics and safety
NO: oral sex
sex (penetration)
observation of sex - real or through multimedia (porn)
Preteen (10-12)
YES: masturbation (alone and mutual)
observation of sex
oral sex
NO: sex
Teen (13-17)
YES: masturbation
sex with a preteen or teen
incestual sex with an adult
non-incestual sex with adult WITH parental supervision
NO: non-incestual sex with an adult w/out parental supervision
Chapter 5 - Some General Thoughts About Underage Sex
====================================================
Let me make this clear yet again - I do NOT have sex of any kind with anyone
who is underage.
Forgetting the complicated moral and ethical issues for a moment, the legal
risks alone are enough to keep me from doing anything like that for real. I
simply won't jeopardize my teaching career or my family's security just for a
few moments of "fun". If you read or hear me say anything different on-line,
then you should automatically assume that I'm just going along with the
conversation and am NOT being serious.
Have you ever noticed how many erotic story and porn sites promote the idea
of young children enjoying sex, even at the age of five or six or even
younger in extreme cases? Now if all this is ONLY someone's fantasy, then
despite any personal objections I may have about the subject matter I
wouldn't condemn it because of my "anything goes when it comes to fantasy"
principle. However, if such actions ARE real, then that's an entirely
different issue.
If there is one crime even more contemptible than rape, it would be child
molestation. To take advantage of the innocence of a child to satisfy
someone's own perverted desires is a heinous and horrific crime.
Psychologists claim that pedophilia is NOT treatable so anyone engaging in
child molestation should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and then
kept isolated from children for the rest of their miserable slimy lives.
Nobody can ever convince me that an infant or child has the ability to
CONSENT to having SEX. By "consent", I'm referring to a mature understanding
of the concept and ramifications, not agreeing to the act itself. Any child
will "consent" to many things a more mature person would not, especially if
they think it would please their parents. Agreeing to do something is not
the same as consenting to it. It's why most of our laws define the legal age
of consent as being eighteen, to ensure the person is mature enough to make
an informed decision.
Because they cannot consent, I do NOT believe that any child or infant should
engage in sex under ANY circumstance. Regardless of whether they "agree" to
it or not, sex with an infant or child is molestation. Even though they
might enjoy it or find it pleasurable, especially at the upper end of the age
range, they should NOT be involved with sex because of the potential negative
implications for their future health - mental and physical. Even preteens
are not old enough in my opinion for most kids to be involved with sex. Of
course this can vary widely amongst different family situations and the
maturity of the child.
While I can't speak authoritatively for boys, I CAN say that even if a young
girl can be physically stimulated and enjoys being touched in a sexual
manner, it doesn't mean she likes SEX per se. All it really means is she
likes to be touched that way. For a young girl, touching her chest and
crotch is no different than touching her back or legs in that she simply
enjoys the feelings she gets when those place are touched.
As an example, my parents use to scratch my back at night when I was young
and I loved it. Often it would help me to fall sleep on those nights when I
was restless. They could just as easily have fondled my pussy and flat chest
with the same results and I would've never have known the difference but that
wouldn't have made it right. A girl needs to learn to respect her body and
to expect others to respect it as well if she is ever going to be comfortable
with herself later in life.
Frankly, I don't believe 99% of the things people tell me they do with kids
but often I'll go along with them if they're interesting to talk to. Over
the years there have been a few situations where I worried that things might
actually be getting out of hand for real at the other end. In those cases I
immediately cut off all contact with that person. Maybe I should've turned
them over to the authorities as well but I just didn't want to be associated
with them any further.
If any of this seems odd to hear from me, it's probably because you've been
reading my chats and e-mails without paying attention to my REAL thoughts and
opinions. While I've chatted with people, exchanged e-mails, and even
written fantasies about preteen and child sex, they have NEVER been anything
more than just fantasies and role-playing for me (as I believe it is for them
as well).
Because of the chats and e-mails and stories I have posted, I know people
often get the wrong impression of me. Even though I say over and over again
how I really feel, people continue to ignore me and then write to accuse me
of being a pedophile or just plain perverted. Thus through this article I'm
trying to put this issue to rest once and for all.
This article was very hard to write as while I feel I fully understand my
principles and guidelines quite well, putting them down on paper was a lot
harder than I'd expected. My apologies if this is getting redundant but I
just want to be sure people don't misunderstand what I'm trying to say and
maybe they can finally understand how I really feel about this subject.
Chapter 6 - A Typical Girl's Sexual Timeline
============================================
Before discussing underage sex, I think it's important to understand the
"normal" timeline for most girls when it comes to dealing with sex. I don't
intend for this to be some sort of sex-ed text so I'll stick just to the
basic sexual acts which I find most resources don't like to discuss with any
sense of reality. If anyone wants to learn about child physical development
and such, there are plenty of web sites available. Also, as I don't have
much experience with boys, most of this discussion will be about girls.
When does a girl learn that nudity is "bad", or least naughty? If you watch
young children, the girls will often run around bare-chested and think
nothing of it - and why should they? They look like the boys and nobody has
taught them yet that it's "wrong" to run around with their nipples showing.
Being worried about nudity is NOT something that comes natural to kids.
Sadly it is something we TEACH our children.
Don't get me wrong - I'm not a nudist and I don't really comprehend the
nudist lifestyle so let's leave that out of the discussion. My belief is
that some modesty is typically called for and that kids should be taught what
is appropriate under what circumstances given our culture and lifestyles.
However, I DO believe we go overboard when it comes to making our kids (and
thus future adults) neurotic about nudity.
Instead of teaching that nudity is wrong, I believe children need to be
taught it is something natural - while not to be flaunted either. For
instance, running around the house bare-ass naked all the time is
inappropriate so far as I'm concerned. However, a girl shouldn't have to
feel be embarrassed just because her daddy or brother sees her naked in the
bathroom - no more than they should have to hide themselves from her when
they get out of the shower.
If kids were taught that there is nothing to be ashamed of when it comes to
their bodies, they wouldn't associate nudity so closely with sex when they
got older. Kids today grow up to be teens thinking that being nude with
someone means you should be having sex with them. That's a screwed-up
connection that simply wouldn't be established if we taught our kids properly
when they were younger.
Because of this misguided connection, and because we teach our kids that sex
is "bad" before marriage, girls start worrying about covering themselves up
at an early age. Even a six year-old will cover her flat chest if exposed
accidentally - but only because her mommy has taught her to react that way.
Then when she reaches puberty and starts to change, she DOES become
embarrassed as she's told that people aren't suppose to see those "naughty"
parts of her. Yet at the same time our society promotes more and more sexy
outfits and skimpy bikinis. Is it any wonder so many teenage girls have such
screwed up self- images?
Another crazy "connection" we teach our kids is that masturbation and sex are
directly related. Masturbation is a healthy, normal act that just about
everyone does, even if they don't like to discuss it or even admit they do
it. Yet for some reason we teach our kids that masturbation is bad, or at
least naughty, as if somehow that will keep them from having sex before they
get older.
This is similar to the point about nudity I just made. Imagine if we taught
our kids that masturbation wasn't something they had to hide or be ashamed of
when they did it. Just think of how much more comfortable they would be with
their own bodies and their own sexuality. Don't get me wrong - I'm not
promoting "masturbation night" or anything ridiculous like that, just that we
allow our kids to understand it's something perfectly natural that their
parents also do and that when they get old enough to do it themselves that's
it's OK. Imagine how much better a long car ride would be if your kids felt
free to masturbate when they got bored?
Placing masturbation on the sexual timeline, I started masturbating when I
was eleven and most girls I know also started around that age although some
waited until as late as thirteen or fourteen, although sixteen is about the
oldest I know of.
It's odd that our society accepts that men masturbate and while they are
supposedly discouraged from doing it (hence all the "hairy palm" warnings),
it seems to be commonly accepted that boys jerk off. However, the same type
of "acceptance" doesn't seem to apply to girls yet so far as I can tell,
girls masturbate just as much as boys - if not more in some cases.
Whatever the case, I think because of all of this that the true extent of
female masturbation is not understood by most boys and I think even most
fathers would be shocked to know how often their daughters were doing
themselves (and probably a few moms as well). It seems such a shame that
they're taught that they have to hide something that is so natural and
commonplace.
By the end of her preteen years, the typical girl is masturbating regularly
and is now starting to consider actually having sex with boys. Her body is
magically transforming and she is well aware that boys (and men) are looking
at her a lot differently than they were not long ago. Unfortunately, she's
been brainwashed to think that she shouldn't show them her private parts of
her body but yet she knows that with some simple flirting she can get a
reaction from them. She's constantly worried that her body doesn't measure
up to her friends and is confused by the conflicting standards set for her by
parents, friends, and society.
Becoming a teenager is quite a difficult time for a girl and the adults in
her life don't help a bit by trying to suppress her natural feelings and
needs.
As a girl gets into her preteen years and approaches her early teens, the
sleepovers with her friends start getting more interesting. Mostly it's just
a lot of teasing and "Truth or Dare" games with little, if any real actions.
Being in a group helps to lower inhibitions. After all, if everyone is doing
it then it's not like it's something personal. The "sleepover" tradition is
usually when most girls have their first kiss and I don't mean with a boy.
Indeed, most girls I know had their first kiss with another girl, not a boy!
For me, it wasn't anything romantic or sexual, just curiosity that was pushed
into action by a dare. For most girls it's a lot safer to learn to kiss with
their friends than with a boy - both emotionally as well physically. I don't
think any of us felt anything really sexual when we kissed, it was more like
holding hands in that we did it just to experiment and have fun.
As girls move further into their teens years, the kissing and teasing between
them starts to get more serious. I was thirteen the first time I masturbated
with another girl. Like my first kiss, it was at a sleepover at a friend's
house and we were up late and getting sort of crazy. We'd been through the
kissing rounds already and now the talk was about boys and how they made us
feel. One thing led to another and soon we were touching ourselves in the
dimly lit room, barely able to see each other. There was nothing overtly
sexual between us and nobody ever made a serious attempt to touch anyone
else. Again, there was safety in numbers and since everyone was doing it
then it was OK.
Fourteen seems to be the age the "early" girls start having sex. There may
be some fondling and heavy petting earlier, but I don't know of many girls
who had voluntarily sex before they turned fourteen. For instance, I was
fourteen when I lost my virginity to my boyfriend. It was at that age when
my mom first had sex. It was also the age my best friend lost her virginity
as well as when my cousins Kristi and Tammy had sex for the first time. That
said, most of my friends waited longer with some even waited until they were
seventeen or eighteen before "doing it". Overall, I would say the most
likely age for girls to lose their virginity is around sixteen with more
losing it before then than after.
Just a note - most of my friends, including me, first had sex with a boy
older than them. For example, Steve was the boy who I had sex with first and
he was sixteen at the time which made him two years older than me.
In summary, for most girls I would say a quick timeline would be innocent
curiosity until masturbation starts sometime after eleven. Then it's kissing
girls, leading to group masturbation with girls between thirteen and
fourteen. Then they start kissing boys and some heavy petting followed by
sex with a boy between fourteen and sixteen.
Of course, these ages can vary significantly based on family backgrounds,
religious convictions, local culture, and a host of other factors. If
anything, I would say these are the "low end" of the time-line spectrum, with
many girls advancing through these steps at later ages - some significantly
later. Personally, I feel it's better to be later than sooner. I'd rather a
girl be sure she is ready than jump in and do something that she regrets
later.
Chapter 7 - Infant Sex (under 8)
===============================
This is the easiest chapter to write. Any child under the age of eight
should NOT be involved in sex in ANY way! That includes ANY form of fondling
or groping in a sexual manner, including oral sex. Children this age should
not be exposed to sex which means keep them out of the bedroom during sex -
or wherever else you do it. It just raises questions for which they are too
young to understand the answers.
What SHOULD be done at this age is help them to learn about nudity and
modesty. It doesn't mean they should be taught to be ashamed of being seen
nude, but they need to understand when it’s appropriate. It's a hard thing
for a child that age to understand fully but at least they’re getting a head
start on most other kids.
Children should be taught enough such they understand how to identify and
protect themselves from molesters. Often that can be done through dolls and
use of non-sexual vocabulary.
Chapter 8 - Child Sex (Ages 8 & 9)
==================================
I don't think that kids this age are even ready to discuss sex, let alone
engage in it. Thus sex for boys and girls should not be allowed at this age.
The basics of sex should begin to be discussed, but that doesn't mean they
need a "demonstration" or anything more direct.
For a girl, her sexuality is a very personal and emotional issue which takes
time to develop. This is why I say she’s not ready at this age for sex, not
to mention the physical limitations of her immature pussy. No matter what
the circumstances, most girls this age could be hurt having sex.
However, all this doesn't mean a girl shouldn’t begin to understand the male
anatomy, particularly the penis. Allowing a girl at this age to fondle a
man's cock shouldn't be something viewed as perverted or obscene. If a
daughter can rub her dad's back then why not his dick? Just because he
becomes sexually aroused doesn't mean SHE does. If it helps her gain
confidence and promotes her self-image as a result of the accolades she
receives as a result, why not let her do it?
I think the earlier a girl learns that a man's penis is fun to play with and
how it makes him happy when she does so, that she will be more likely to be
open to oral sex and ENJOY it when she is older rather than simply tolerate
it because her boyfriend or husband enjoys it.
One thing to keep in mind though. If the guy can't control his urges under
the circumstances then THAT is another issue and would serve as a case
against her touching him again, at least until she’s older and he can respond
without causing problems.
For boys, while sex is off-limits their dicks can still respond and they
should be taught why and how it can give them pleasure. Hand-jobs with a
young boy is fine so long as he is old enough to get an erection and orgasm,
even though he may not yet ejaculate. It really doesn't matter who does it,
the act is the same so whether it's a girl his age or an older woman it's all
basically the same.
Childhood is a period in a young child's life when kids learn that adults do
certain things that kids can't - no different than they can drive cars and
other "adult" activities. Even so, I don't think parents should have sex in
front of their kids but they can still be intimate and loving. Masturbation
need not be hidden but at the same time, a child in this age group usually
isn't ready to masturbate. Thus all that needs to be taught is that it’s OK
for mom and dad and that someday they will want to do it too.
Chapter 9 - Preteen Sex (Ages 10-12)
====================================
As a reminder, I do not believe in preteen sex in general as most girls that
age are simply not mature enough to make such a life-changing decision. It's
an age when girls are already struggling to deal with the onset of puberty
and are anxiously trying desperately to "grow up". All this makes them easy
to influence, even when it's not in their best interest. For an adult to
take advantage of a preteen's natural instincts and curiosity for their own
pleasure is simply wrong.
Given many girls start masturbating as preteens, it's not like a parent can
just hope to ignore the issue of sex at this age either. Thus parents should
actively encourage masturbation, allowing their kids to freely do it when
they need to without having to run to their rooms and hide. Kids should
learn that their budding sexuality is a gift, not a curse or something
shameful.
The preteen years are also the time for parents to give the detailed version
of the "birds and bees" talk. Some parents find that allowing their kids to
watch them having sex is easier than trying to explain it. Whatever works I
guess.
I also believe that at as they approach their teen years that mutual
masturbation should also be encouraged. There's no reason why boys and girls
shouldn't masturbate together and learn about each other's sexuality although
it should be supervised to ensure they don't get too carried away.
The preteen years are a great age for girls to learn how to give oral sex.
It allows her to express her burgeoning sexuality in a non-sexual, non-
threatening manner. It also provides a man to have the opportunity to
satisfy his "needs" with girl this age without engaging in actual sex.
Basically I see it as a decent compromise where a girl can express her
sexuality while still maintaining proper boundaries.
Similarly, at this age boys are becoming more curious about sex so by
allowing them to lick pussy and receive oral sex this can allow them to
satisfy their urges while keeping the proper boundaries about sex in place.
Chapter 10 - Teen Sex (Ages 13-17)
==================================
First, this is not intended to be a debate regarding premarital sex or the
morality of teenage sex. It is a simple fact that sex between consenting
teens has always been and always will be with us and nothing we say or do is
going to change that. Personally, I believe if we taught our kids proper
methods of birth control, how to avoid the risk of STDs, and perhaps even a
bit about HOW to do it, that we would have a lot less problems with sexually
transmitted disease and teen pregnancies. Some of this should be taught in
school, some in church, and some at home. It doesn't matter to me WHERE kids
learn it so long as it's not at the playground or the backseat of a car!
Teenage sex is probably the most pure and unadulterated form of sex. Teens
may think they’re in love but it's all raging hormones and lust. I think if
we were cavemen that this would be the age when procreation would be at its
peak as our bodies are youthful and strong. How do you tell two teenagers
NOT to have sex when everything in them is driving them to do it? Why are we
trying to thwart the natural laws of nature? Why don't we instead HELP them
by making it easier to have SAFE sex?
Thus I see nothing wrong with two underage kids having sex - of course
assuming it's consensual. In fact, I think parents should actively encourage
their kids to be open about sex and provide them with a safe environment
where they can practice safe sex without the fear of "being caught". It's
not like they need to "perform" for their parents or anything ridiculous like
that. Rather mom and dad should respect their kid's privacy, allowing the
bedroom door to be closed and then not say anything afterwards about it which
would embarrass either of them.
My parents did just this with me when I was dating, although I don't think
most of the boys I brought home realized it. They would stay downstairs in
the family room and so far as the boy was concerned, were totally oblivious
to what we were doing in my bedroom. It was certainly a lot better than
trying to get laid in the backseat of a car plus I felt a whole lot more
secure having sex at home which allowed me to enjoy myself more, knowing my
dad was not far away should anything get out of hand.
When it comes to sex between adults and underage teens, that's a lot more
complicated. First of all, it's illegal in every state although the age of
consent varies considerably (which is insane when you think about it).
Sex with younger boys isn't my biggest fantasy in any case, but because it IS
illegal that I avoid having sex with underage boys and girls not matter what
my feelings may be at the time. Not only would it jeopardize my family, as a
teacher it would end my career if anything like that became public knowledge
so it's just not worth the risk for me. There have been many opportunities
for me to be with a younger boy over the years, but I have ALWAYS turned them
down.
Another factor to keep in mind when considering sex between an adult and an
underage teen is WHY they are doing it. Face it, you can try and rationalize
it all you want but in the end it's all about lust and sexual self-
gratification. It's not like there is anything romantic involved, or any
intent to establish a relationship. So is it worth it? Personally I don't
think so.
Thus as a general rule I would advise that sex between adults and underage
teens should be avoided. Then again, although this is NOT something I
recommend or promote, if it IS done then the girl should be at least fourteen
and the boy sixteen at a minimum.
The exception to all this is incest.
Chapter 11 - Incestual Sex
==========================
This is a touchy subject as people have been using incest to rationalize
child molestation for centuries - probably one of the major reasons why
incest is illegal in every state. Assuming (and I realize this is a HUGE
assumption), that the family is practicing PROPER incest and not just taking
advantage of their children, I believe underage sex is appropriate so long as
it is done with the proper family support, respect and love.
If a father wants to use sex as a means to form an intimate relationship with
his daughter, demonstrating his fatherly love for her and showing his respect
for her as a woman, then what could possibly be wrong with doing so?. On the
other hand, if sex between a father and daughter is nothing more than a forty
year-old man wanting to fuck a fourteen year-old girl and he is using his
daughter only to fulfill his lust, then that’s clearly wrong. It's
impossible to totally keep lust out of the equation, nor should it be, but it
shouldn't be the driving factor.
Even with incest I believe a girl should be at least thirteen before she has
sex with the men in her family such as her father or uncle. If I REALLY had
my druthers, she might start having sex at fourteen with someone more her age
like a brother or cousin and wait a couple more years before even considering
doing any of the adults in her family (although I would make an exception in
allowing her dad to have her virginity). Basically, the older a girl is
before she starts having sex, the better from every emotional and physical
perspective. Then again, if a girl is truly ready (as I feel I was when I
was fourteen), then why hold her back because of some arbitrary age limit?
What about younger brothers and sisters having sex? As teens, I would apply
basically the same rules as for teenagers in general. Just think about how
it would be if they were just a boy and girl and school and apply the same
rules. Being brother and sister doesn't really make any difference so far
was whether they SHOULD do it or not. Whether or not they WANT to should be
entirely up to them and not as a result of any pressure applied by the
family. Face it, most brother and sisters don't even get along well enough
to want to sit next to each other in the car, let alone have sex.
When it comes to younger siblings, it's about the same as for when discussing
either one of them in isolation. If a boy is old enough to get an erection
and can feel sexual pleasure from a hand-job or blowjob, then why not let his
sister do it? Brothers, like fathers, should leave their sister's sexual
areas alone until she is ready to have real sex with them.
Chapter 12 - Changes in My Views
================================
Everything in this article up until now was written years ago based on the
teachings of my parents and church. I was never actually involved in any
such activity that wasn’t incestual so it’s not like I was any kind of
expert.
Well, my eyes were opened when I become more closely involved with the
subject. It wasn't that long ago when I learned that my father’s pedophile
nature had been a large part of the reason my parents divorced. I also
didn’t know until not all long ago that my dad and aunt were actively
involved with groups that promoted swapping of family members during group
sex sessions - including their children (or should I say, especially their
children).
It wasn’t just my father and aunt that changed my view. I learned after we
were married that my husband shared many of the same addictions and feelings
that my father did when it came to underage sex, particularly with preteens
and younger teens. Until then it was just a fantasy for him, like most men,
but once he joined the family and started having sex with my aunt she
introduced him to the same opportunities she gave my dad and he was hooked.
Being a wife and daughter brings me many pleasures and opportunities. It
also comes with certain duties and obligations. While I enjoy the benefits
of my husband and father’s love - not to mention their checkbooks, at the
same time I honor my father through submission and fulfill my marital duties
by submitting to my husband as outlined in the Bible. Don't take that wrong
- I’m NOT their slave and I mean submission in a totally loving way - but in
the end it pretty much means I do what they tell me.
As a result there have been times when my father or husband wanted to engage
in underage sex but needed me to join them as the group rules state that no
singles are allowed. You can imagine that given my position on underage sex
as described earlier, it was difficult for me to rationalize getting involved
so I had to find some means of dealing with the conflicts to where I could
feel good about my actions without compromising my core morals and ethics.
Perhaps what helped me adapt the most was gaining actual experience against
which to compare my earlier moral positions. There are lots of things that
seem correct in theory but in the end don’t stand up when seen in the real
world. My position on underage sex was largely based on what my mother
taught me and what I learned through the media and church. Seeing it
practiced in real life was an eye-opener to be sure.
Even though I’ve adjusted a few things, I don’t feel that I’ve abandon my
basic morals and principles. There are lines that have to be drawn if you’re
going to be true to yourself, just as my mother finally had to divorce my dad
even though she still loved him as much as ever. The three basic principles
I described at the start of this article are still my bedrock. It’s only how
they are achieved that has changed.
So what changed my mind? I use to think that a preteen girl was too young
for sex until I actually saw them doing. Granted, it was all done in a safe
environment free of perverts and other such influences but then that’s how it
should be! When I actually witnessed a twelve year-old ASKING for sex from
an older man completely on her own volition, and then seeing how much she
enjoyed it, I was left with no choice but to reconsider my position.
It wasn't just because the kids were OK with what they were doing that
convinced me. As I’ve said, kids will do most anything if they think it will
please their parents so it doesn’t necessarily mean that they really want to
do it. WATCHING wasn’t enough to tell me the truth.
The tipping point for me was the first time I personally had sex with a young
boy and was able to FEEL his desire and lust. When he was fucking me I could
just tell that he wasn't doing it just to please me or his parents, he
clearly wanted it for himself. Clearly I needed to adjust my position on the
subject to reflect reality.
Keep in mind that it’s not like we have sex with underage kids all the time.
In fact such events are quite rare, at least for us as a couple. As you
might expect, my husband’s much more involved than me but at least now I can
condone what he’s doing and not worry about the impact it’s having on the
girls he is having sex with.
So here’s a summary of my CURRENT opinions regarding underage sex. Who
knows, maybe I’ll change them all again in time but for now, this is it:
Infant (7 and under)
YES: familiarization with nudity with instruction regarding modesty
information limited to that needed for protection from predators
NO: ANY sexual activity including oral sex and fondling of sex organs
ANY involvement in sexual activities, e.g. watching sex by others
ANY detailed discussions about sex
Exposure to pornographic images
No changes here but I admit to being on the line regarding oral sex.
If there was some way to ensure that things stayed confined to oral
sex then I’d probably condone it but most people simply can’t properly
deal with such complications.
Child (8-9)
YES: hand stimulation - self and others
observation of masturbation
discussions about sex focusing on the mechanics and safety
NO: oral sex
sex (penetration)
observation of sex - real or through multimedia (porn)
Again, no changes here. I DO think even more though that oral should
be promoted more at this age as it can help to bridge between the age
of blissful ignorance and the beginnings of sex.
Preteen (10-12)
YES: masturbation
sex with another underage partner
sex with an adult under the supervision of parents
incestual sex with an adult
NO: unsupervised non-incestual sex with an adult
This is one big change for me - condoning sex with this age with an
adult. This is based entirely on personally witnessing such activity
and seeing for myself the reactions of the kids. The catch is it must
be supervised by their parents or family member. In the case of
incest, self-supervision can be employed.
Teen (13-17)
YES: sex with an adult
NO: only what their personal convictions do not allow (anal, etc.)
If you’re going to condone preteen sex with adults, then it’s hard not
to allow teens the same rights with even more flexibility. Of course
this all should be closely monitored and in cases supervised by
parents depending on the maturity level.
THE END