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Jeff Zephir
Note:
The original versions of thess posts can be found at On Sat, 27 Jan 2001 03:36:42 GMT, Sigerson wrote: A reader asked me a question regarding the last set of stories that I posted. He wanted to know why all three stories started so similarly. I had posted a comment about all three stories starting from the same premise and they would naturally start the same way. Two other readers mentioned this same point, which makes me wonder why I posted the explanation. One reader actually liked the explanation and the idea of three stories starting at the same point but going in totally different directions. Maybe, they missed the comment? Wasn't it in a separate post, not in each story section? That got me thinking about the way that I start writing a story. I thought I would share my method with all of you. Usually it starts when I visualize a scene that is quite vivid. Not all of the detail is present but there is enough that I can write a description that is strong enough to recreate it in my mind later on. Each of these scenes is about one page of single spaced text. That way can work. I tend to mix scene and characters. The characters are together in a place where the situation can become interesting. The scene, for me, is very much what the characters are doing, and what they feel. Something unusual, a tension, shock, surprise. These scenes are not really story ideas. I do have files of those also but I have found that if the idea is not worth pursuing at the time I write it, it is usually not worth pursuing at all. Story ideas are shorter. All of the stories that I have posted have started as scenes not as story ideas. I'd think most of mine did. Some are nothing more than scenes. The story only covers a few minutes or hours, maybe days. I don't know, I can write a *lot* of things into a weekend meeting, so even if it is just one scene, it ends up having a lot of decoration around it. The writing classes that I took in college insisted that good stories come from strong characters. I have found this to be the case. They also insisted that we develop characters first. But I find those strong characters are difficult to develop without some context in which to place them. That is why I started using this scene-character-plot method of story development. Do any of you write this way? I can't believe that I am the only one. Based on my output of posted stories this does not appear to be an efficient way of writing. It is hard to tell what is efficient or best for writing. I'm sure that whatever method works for you is a good one. My own method may not be efficient, for finishing stories, but it is pretty good for starting them. I'll have an idea for a story, and daydream it a bit, before writing it. If the idea feels like an interesting fantasy in my mind, it can turn into an interesting story when it gets fleshed out. Often, a chance real life thing can trigger this, or a memory. I have a several of these scene files that I can turn to when I need the beginning of a story or a turning point. When I use a scene as a turning point I have to create the things that happened before and after the scene so that usually ends up being more difficult to write. All of the stories that have come from these turning point scenes are still on my hard drive and are in no danger of being inflicted on an unsuspecting world. How do you develop a story? I use different methods, depending on length and purpose. My main method is straightforward. I envision the tale in my mind, as a situation. I then write out what happened, briefly, beginning to end. At least, to the end of a chapter. Sometimes, I make notes on the characters, but usually, I have them well in mind when I write the story, and fill it out with dialog or descriptions in this phase. That leaves a rough 1st draft. It looks like some of the stories I've seen posted ;-) but I'm not willing to leave it in that state. From this version, I'll rewrite it as a 2nd draft, adding details. Shorter tales work better writing the thing out from my mind as a whole. Start at the beginning, go to the end. Works best for under 3000 words, 5000 tops. I do write longer stuff. Some of you might have noticed. Memory/reality based stories tend to be a mix. If I have the situation clear in mind, I can just write out the story. But often, it is easier to write out what happened, as I'd tell it to a friend (or post here ;-), without turning it into a story. No or little dialog, "just the facts Ma'am" style. OK for a start, but not what I want as a *story*. To finish, I rewrite it adding dialog and details, descriptions, feelings, trying to get across what happened as if I was there, rather than telling someone else about it. Linking these parts together is also tricky. Chronology in memory is often confusing -- I know what happened, but not for sure which things involving different people happened when. Not sure if that helps. My stories get stuck sometimes because I'm not content with the finish, find it hard to make certain scenes come out as I'd like. Not because I can't finish the story line, or don't know what will happen next. That can happen, but so far, it is only in longer tales, series, where I can pick up what happens next, but could stop it at the current episode. Each part can stand on its own. #1 reason for not finishing is real life interruptions. Given a choice between writing about sex and doing it, I have a hard time writing (though it makes a nice preparation activity). There are many other interruptions, and I find it hard to write amid distractions. Jeff
Web site at
http://www.asstr-mirror.org/files/Authors/jeffzephyr/www/
On Sat, 27 Jan 2001 06:02:47 GMT, Katie McN wrote: Hi Sigerson! On Sat, 27 Jan 2001 03:36:42 GMT, you might have said: <edit of Sigerson's story development method> I've read quite a number of writing books and find that successful authors follow all different story development methods and the rule seems to be that the one the works is the one you should use. Absolutely. The hard part is getting finished stories out that you like. Anything that makes that happen is a good idea. 'The one that works' means a method that actually produces stories people want to read. We hear over and over again about the BHC and how this person or that has 50, 100, 150 or more stories in some state of not complete on their hard drive. The method they are using might not be a good one. I'm not sure about that, but as a BHC member there might be something to it. Part of it has to do with being picky. Most incomplete stories are either fairly well along (1st draft completed), or just outlines and scene sketches, suitable for using later, when I feel like turning them into the full story the idea inspired. I can't work on it all, due to lack of time, so I make choices. I'm currently writing two stories for fans as a tune up for an important long form story I'm working on as a collaboration. I have one story for an author that will happen after the collaboration. I just released a story called Katie McN:A Slut's Story which can be found here http://assm.asstr-mirror.org/Year2001/28521 . While each story started out from a different idea, the process I use is the same. Pressure to finish can help. Doesn't matter if it is from the outside (fan demands) or internal (promise yourself you'll work on it). Once you get going on a tale, you might find it easier to write. Getting started on it can be harder. Finishing it, OTOH, is one of my weaknesses. For the Nympho Challenge, I did Angelina in short order. Now, I actually thought about the thing for a couple weeks before writing it. Then, I used my rough draft/2nd draft method to write it out, with one more pass for very simple editing. If I hadn't got the rough draft to feel right, I never would have got to the next step. A story can sit at any of these stages: #1 -- the idea. Not even a whole story concept, just the bare bits, enough to inspire later. #2, rough draft. It is a story, start to finish, but there is a lot missing, either in details, dialog, character, or polish. #3, well, a story can be partway through 2nd draft too, as Angelina part 3 is. I know what I've wrote to happen, but have to spell it all out. #4, 2nd draft done, but not ready to edit it. #5, it is edited, but I'm not happy with it, and put it away for later. By many standards, it is done at this point (some could call a story done at stage #2 ;-). Once I have the idea I think about it for some period of time. This could be a day or a week and sometimes more than that. The main pieces fall together during this time and at a certain point I have to start writing. I call this point the place where the story is forcing itself out. I think about the story bits a lot, especially when I have nothing else to occupy my mind. I may not write it down at all until I have a full idea in mind. On Angelina part 3, since it is still in progress, I can describe what I've done well. First draft was done before the holidays, but I didn't want to post it. Putting it off due to RL things meant that when I resumed writing, I had to reread it all again, thinking about how I wanted the scenes to come off. That took a few days ;-) Next, writing. I didn't do a word count, but I spent a lot of time covering the scene in the morning, following the events of part 2. Guess? 3000-5000 words, it is a short story in itself. One love scene, with several sex acts, and some more background. That is about where I left off. The next scene introduces Janey, her new teacher/lover, and I just know I'm going to have a lot to say about that. There are another dozen scenes ;-) I could shorten it, and it may actually turn into parts 3 and 4 (or more), as I don't want any one part to go much over 6k words, for posting reasons. Given time, I feel I can just write out the rest. I have in my mind the feeling of what happened, and the rough draft covers the activities in short, if not the details or dialog. It will get done now, at least to stage #4. My edit pass on Angelina #1/#2 was fast. I did send it to Katie for her comments, but the essential story was already there, just cleaning up. But my muse pushes me into other areas. JZL, a huge project, gets things dropped in when they come to mind. Remembering everything that was interesting in my life (up to college graduation, my cut off time for personal reasons -- things more recent tend to involve current relationships, and I'm just not ready to fictionalize them for an audience) isn't easy, and when a nice memory scene comes up, I want to write it down. Or work on earlier parts, adding things I find hard to write about the first time, easier after thinking a while. I could take those memories, and put them to other characters, not use them in my personal tale. But it seems like a waste. I can make up imaginary things just fine, and I do use RL memories for inspiration. My fantasy life seems to work out great, no trouble finding interesting ideas tucked away in my imagination. Finding ones I can let out is harder, but it still works fine. I used to develop a lot of the same documentation you describe in your post, but I no longer do that. I found that the story will start writing itself at a certain point and so all the preliminary work I do is generally a waste of time. Frequently this is a way to avoid starting to write and yet sill feel like some work is being accomplished. An outline is enough to get me going and possibly a character description if these are characters I've not used before. Outlines do sometimes help. For really long stories, character lists too. Naming is a problem. Especially JZL, where I have to rename most people in it ;-) But that isn't always a big deal in writing, finding names for people and stuff. I let the story sit for a day and read it over again. I've always found that there are going to be little things that have to change during this process. I tend to let it sit longer. But not always. I'll be chomping at the bit, or something like that, wanting to post it if I feel it is good, and done. Especially, done, so I don't have to work on it again ;-) So, sending it off for editing makes me impatient. When I've finished all that I send the story to Denny. Sometimes he sends it back and says it's done. He can change my stories and doesn't have to inform me that he does. In some cases he questions story concepts and I do a rewrite. Since I'm not in love with any of it, I usually have no problem making the changes that he suggests. He may get the story back at this point for another go round or I could just send it out depending on what changed. I sometimes love parts of it, but usually can tell that editing suggestions are meant to help. A few cases, it is misunderstanding, but if my editor doesn't understand, readers may not either, so a bit of fixing can help it. [snip good method and story info] I would very much like to here from other people who would be willing to share their methods. And, I hope Rui Jorge could start a web page for the methods. We talked about this before when we had the discussion on categories and lost the opportunity to save some valuable material. I think this thread could provide a lot of useful information which authors could benefit from over time. It could be. I don't know if I can try other people's methods, but I can find things they do which fit my style, perhaps, and use them to help me out. Biggest help for finishing it having time to write, and using it for writing rather than other activities. I can't write as much as I'd like to, but I can easily put off writing when I have the chance, just by letting myself think about how I just don't know how to start, today. Perhaps tomorrow will be better. Or, I have this other work to do, it is important. Or I just want to play, and other kinds of play are fun too, necessary. But not always as satisfying as finishing a story. Jeff
Web site at
http://www.asstr-mirror.org/files/Authors/jeffzephyr/www/
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